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> Sing a classic song (Kung-Fu Fighting) and get arrested for offending Chinese people
ColonelKlink
post Apr 28th 2011, 3:23 PM
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This is the world that liberals have foisted upon us. If you get offended by something then have the government arrest the person who offended you.

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A pub singer has been arrested on suspicion of racism for singing the classic chart hit Kung Fu Fighting.

The song, performed by Simon Ledger, 34, is said to have offended two Chinese people as they walked past the bar where he was singing.

The entertainer regularly performs the 1974 number one hit, originally by disco star Carl Douglas, at the Driftwood Beach Bar in Sandown, on the Isle of Wight.

But after one of the passers-by reported his routine on Sunday afternoon, Mr Ledger was arrested on suspicion of racially aggravated harassment.

‘We were performing Kung Fu Fighting, as we do during all our sets,’ he said.

‘People of all races were loving it. Chinese people have never been offended by it before.

‘But this lad walking past with his mum started swearing at us and making obscene hand gestures before taking a picture on his mobile phone.

'We hadn’t even seen them when we started the song. He must have phoned the police.’

Officers later called Mr Ledger while he was eating in a Chinese restaurant to arrange a meeting.

The singer assumed it was a prank – but he was later arrested and is still under investigation.

‘They seemed pretty amazed but said the law is the law and it was their duty,’ he is reported to have said.

‘It’s political correctness gone potty. There are plenty of Welsh people at our shows – does it mean I can’t play any Tom Jones?’


Read the rest of the report.


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CarrieFan702
post Apr 29th 2011, 3:17 PM
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First of all, I read the entire article, and there was no evidence to prove liberals were behind this unless you're being extremely stereotypical. What makes you think that liberals are behind this? Is it because the people stood up for a person who felt that their culture was being insulted, and you concluded that they're liberal? If that's the case, by your thoughts, you're concluding that conservatives are the racist, and liberals stand up against racism. This does not look good for you, and your ultra-conservative beliefs. Look, I'm getting really tired of logging onto this board and having to try and ignore your hateful, and bigoted threads. For one, it is completely prejudiced to conclude that everything wrong in this country is because of a liberal. What if I post 500 negative stories in the message board, state conservatives are behind it, and conclude that conservatives are destroying this country? Your threads are becoming COMPLETELY disrespectful to others on this board who have different opinions as you. Please stop lying, being prejudice, hateful, and a bigot.

This post has been edited by CarrieFan702: Apr 29th 2011, 3:42 PM


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juniorfan4eva
post Apr 29th 2011, 3:48 PM
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QUOTE(CarrieFan702 @ Apr 29th 2011, 4:17 PM) *

First of all, I read the entire article, and there was no evidence to prove liberals were behind this unless you're being extremely stereotypical. What makes you think that liberals are behind this? Is it because the people stood up for a person who felt that their culture was being insulted, and you concluded that they're liberal? If that's the case, by your thoughts, you're concluding that conservatives are the racist, and liberals stand up against racism. This does not look good for you, and your ultra-conservative beliefs. Look, I'm getting really tired of logging onto this board and having to try and ignore your hateful, and bigoted threads. For one, it is completely prejudiced to conclude that everything wrong in this country is because of a liberal. What if I post 500 negative stories in the message board, state conservatives are behind it, and conclude that conservatives are destroying this country? Your threads are becoming COMPLETELY disrespectful to others on this board who have different opinions as you. Please stop lying, being prejudice, hateful, and a bigot.

Liberals are the root of all evil in his books. Frailty, thy name is Liberals! rolleyes.gif


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ColonelKlink
post Apr 29th 2011, 8:45 PM
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QUOTE(CarrieFan702 @ Apr 29th 2011, 1:17 PM) *

First of all, I read the entire article, and there was no evidence to prove liberals were behind this unless you're being extremely stereotypical. What makes you think that liberals are behind this?

Liberals have been the driving force behind the draconian human rights legislation which penalizes and arrests people for exercising free speech. Liberals have made insulting people because of their race or ethnicity a crime. Liberals, in Canada and the UK, have removed truth as a basis for defense in court proceedings. Liberals have made laws which don't give any weight to whether intent to insult was present and instead have given significance to the concept of whether insult was felt. A person can be guilty of a speech crime by saying something which is not intended to insult, or which is a true statement, but which offends the listener. This political correctness crap has been spawned by liberals. Own it.
QUOTE
Is it because the people stood up for a person who felt that their culture was being insulted, and you concluded that they're liberal?

People standing up for their beliefs is an apolitical action. The Chinese people who complained have every right to be insulted. However their complaining to the police doesn't make them liberals, it just makes them jerkwads. The laws which the police enforced, passed by liberals, are the root of the problem. Absent those laws those two Chinese people could have kept their feeling of insult to themselves or they could have exercised their right to free speech and gone up to the singer and complained. The singer could have sympathized with them or told them to go stuff themselves. That's where it should have ended.
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For one, it is completely prejudiced to conclude that everything wrong in this country is because of a liberal.

There is not some unwritten law in the universe which apportions blame proportionately across political philosophy. Look, it's as simple as this - the more expansive a political philosophy the more opportunity it has to cause problems. The liberal penchant for micromanaging people's lives creates a plethora of opportunity for their principles to cause problems.
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What if I post 500 negative stories in the message board, state conservatives are behind it, and conclude that conservatives are destroying this country?

I'd welcome it. You don't need to ask my permission. Go right ahead. I'll read what you have to write and if I disagree with you then I'll make the case for why you're wrong.
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Your threads are becoming COMPLETELY disrespectful to others on this board who have different opinions as you.

Respect has to be earned, it's not granted. When I meet a racist, a socialist or a Nazi I don't owe them respect. Liberals are working night and day to strip people of the freedom of speech, the freedom of association and they're intruding into people's lives with their Nanny impulses. Why should I grant respect to people who are out to harm my interests and the way I choose to live my life?
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Please stop lying, being prejudice, hateful, and a bigot.

In other words stop pointing out things you can't refute and that make you feel bad about the way you see the world. No, you should feel bad for adhering to a philosophy which criminalizes free speech. A singer was arrested for singing an old-time disco song because someone was offended. That's outrageous. It's because of people like you that such draconian laws are passed.


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sneaky
post Apr 29th 2011, 9:37 PM
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Why do I think the whole story is not being told here? I wonder what else the (drunken) karaoke singer was doing.

Think about it..


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JohnA
post Apr 29th 2011, 10:54 PM
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QUOTE(ColonelKlink @ Apr 29th 2011, 8:45 PM) *
Liberals have made insulting people because of their race or ethnicity a crime.

Ain't you happy about that?

QUOTE(ColonelKlink @ Apr 29th 2011, 8:45 PM) *
Liberals, in Canada and the UK, have removed truth as a basis for defense in court proceedings. Liberals have made laws which don't give any weight to whether intent to insult was present and instead have given significance to the concept of whether insult was felt. A person can be guilty of a speech crime by saying something which is not intended to insult, or which is a true statement, but which offends the listener. This political correctness crap has been spawned by liberals. Own it.

That's a legitimate argument. Going overboard with political correctness ain't good. Extremism in any direction ain't good. But just because things go overboard in the liberal direction sometimes, doesn't mean criminalizing discrimination was wrong in the first place. Obviously you will agree, I refuse to believe you could think actual discrimination and hate speech shouldn't be criminalized.


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ColonelKlink
post Apr 30th 2011, 4:07 AM
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QUOTE(JohnA @ Apr 29th 2011, 8:54 PM) *

Obviously you will agree, I refuse to believe you could think actual discrimination and hate speech shouldn't be criminalized.

Not obviously at all. The remedy to speech you disagree with is to offer better speech in return rather than jailing the person who says something that you find upsetting.

I'm all for discrimination. People do it all the time, for instance, some women discriminate against male OB/GYN's on the basis of sex because they don't want a man poking around down there. Good for the women exercising their right to discriminate as they choose. If you don't want to discriminate then you should live you life by not practicing discrimination. When a woman who doesn't appeal to you asks you out be sure not to discriminate against her on the basis of appearance, weight, race, age, bad breath, personality, or what have you.

As for hate speech, I'm all for it. Let the person uttering "hate speech" have the full rope with which to hang himself. Most of the content of hate speech is pretty stupid so society doesn't benefit by forcefully suppressing stupid ideas and giving them life in closed, self-reinforcing circles where it is never challenged. Sunlight is a pretty good disinfectant so let speech be free and this allows better arguments to be mounted against "hate speech."

Putting people in jail because they say something to offend you should itself be a crime.


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bumnummies
post Apr 30th 2011, 9:39 AM
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They had a right to be offended and question the actions of the singer and therefore the police needed to launch an investigation based on the complaint. Obviously these Chinese people didn't know that this is part of his set list week after week and that it wasn't targeted towards them, but it doesn't change that they were offended by it and had any right to be offended by it. So now that the police have launched an investigation, it's up to the police to determine if they feel the singer was acting out of any ill intent to offend these individuals or if it was in fact, a simple misunderstanding.

The fact is, race & hate crimes, as minor as they are, do happen, and even the littlest, simplest things require investigation. I mean, if people weren't A-holes in the first place we wouldn't need laws that protect minorities, now would we?

I could be offended by a band singing "Fat Bottomed Girls" and feel that it was derogatory as well; how do I know that I didn't walk in and he decided to make a statement of my presence, not unlike these Chinese folks? It's all a matter of perception, and honestly no one is at fault for this misunderstanding.


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ColonelKlink
post Apr 30th 2011, 4:25 PM
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QUOTE(bumnummies @ Apr 30th 2011, 7:39 AM) *

They had a right to be offended and question the actions of the singer and therefore the police needed to launch an investigation based on the complaint.

For those people who are just joining us they should know that you've outright claimed that you're a socialist, so when I declare that I'm offended by the things that you write based on your love of socialism should that give me the right to call the police and have you arrested? After all, I have a right to be offended, you said so yourself. My being offended by you gives me the right to have you arrested for offending me. See, even this post of yours and the logic you use offends me.



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CarrieFan702
post Apr 30th 2011, 6:42 PM
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QUOTE(ColonelKlink @ Apr 29th 2011, 8:45 PM) *

Liberals have been the driving force behind the draconian human rights legislation which penalizes and arrests people for exercising free speech. Liberals have made insulting people because of their race or ethnicity a crime.


You're upset because liberals have made insulting a person because of their race or ethnicity a crime. This is not understandable, because racism regardless of the level should NOT be tolerated, especially if it is in a place of business! I do not agree that the guy should be arrested, because the punishment does not fit the crime. People have a freedom to be a racist, but it is NOT right. The guy who sang the song was exercising his right to free speech, just like if a man sings songs that degrade women while they're not present, that is ALSO exercising freedom of speech. If a white man calls black people derogatory terms that is ALSO free speech. However, in each of those cases they're actions are wrong. We now have laws that protect people from being a victim of racism, bigotry, discrimination, etc., and that's the problem that you're having. The part that upsets you is that he was punished for ignorantly insulting someones race (which is also what would anger a racist). Your argument has failed because racism, bigotry, and misogyny are NO longer tolerated, and if someone feels insulted because of their race, nationality, culture, sex, etc. it should be taken seriously. You know that this only proves to all of us, that you're a racist. Let me just educate you for a second. It will NEVER be right to insult someone because of the color of their skin, ethnicity, nationality, gender, sex, etc. The reason why you're so upset, and have made it an issue by posting it on this board is because you can no longer do those harmful things, and you feel threatened because you feel that your "rights of free speech" are threatened. Let me break it down for you. There's two sides in this story. Standing up for the person who felt insulted based on their culture/race/nationality, or standing up for the person who insulted the person based on their culture/race/nationality. You're deeply on the racist side, and I feel sorry for you because either you don't know that you're a racist, or you know that you're a racist but you're hiding it and instead despising things such as multiculturalism, while standing up for the rights of your fellow racist.

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People standing up for their beliefs is an apolitical action. The Chinese people who complained have every right to be insulted. However their complaining to the police doesn't make them liberals, it just makes them jerkwads.


That does NOT make them jerkwads. If someone believes that they're insulted because of their race/nationality/culture they have the right to complain. Again, there's two sides here, and you have again just sided your self with your fellow ignorant racist. Putting someone down because of their race/nationality/culture is NOT okay, and it will never be okay. I know that you wish that it was in the 1800 where racism was loud and proud, but we will NEVER go back to the times when someone can "mistakenly" insult someone because of their race.

QUOTE
The laws which the police enforced, passed by liberals, are the root of the problem. Absent those laws those two Chinese people could have kept their feeling of insult to themselves or they could have exercised their right to free speech and gone up to the singer and complained. The singer could have sympathized with them or told them to go stuff themselves. That's where it should have ended.


The Chinese people should not have to keep their feelings to them self because if they're insulted on the basis of their race it should NOT be tolerated. You wanting them to keep it to themselves will only help racism (whether done intentionally or unintentionally) to continue to occur. Also, if someone confronts a person with racism, they are not going to admit it. Just like if someone confronts a killer, they are not going to admit to their victim that they're a killer. However, penalizing the killer just like penalizing a racist will hopefully eliminate their harmful actions.

QUOTE
There is not some unwritten law in the universe which apportions blame proportionately across political philosophy. Look, it's as simple as this - the more expansive a political philosophy the more opportunity it has to cause problems. The liberal penchant for micromanaging people's lives creates a plethora of opportunity for their principles to cause problems.


Either you're extremely ignorant, and really don't know the differences between the political philosophies, or you are lying to everyone thinking that we're not smart enough to know the difference. I tell you what--I'll just conclude that you're just extremely ignorant, and I will ask you to go educate yourself. Read the difference between what it is to be a social liberal and social conservative (from an objective source), and see which political philosophy micromanages peoples lives. I'll give you a hint, one has a motto of "live and let live" and the other has an extremely authoritarian philosophy with the goal of creating order in society.


QUOTE
Liberals are working night and day to strip people of the freedom of speech, the freedom of association and they're intruding into people's lives with their Nanny impulses.


Again, you have presented yourself to be either extremely ignorant, or you're a compulsive liar. Go educate yourself and see where the two political ideologies stand on government intruding into people's personal lives.

QUOTE
In other words stop pointing out things you can't refute and that make you feel bad about the way you see the world. No, you should feel bad for adhering to a philosophy which criminalizes free speech. A singer was arrested for singing an old-time disco song because someone was offended. That's outrageous. It's because of people like you that such draconian laws are passed.


You are so quick to think I am a liberal because it is easy for you to do the least amount of thinking possible, and label someone according to an incorrect stereotype that you have formed. Guess what--I'm an Independent who have both liberal and and conservative leanings. I am all for free speech, and people should NOT be arrested for using their right to free speech. What I DO have a problem with is racist like yourself, who are quick to jump on the side of the person who unintentionally insulted someones race. You have presented yourself as a racist, but the good thing is that you're fighting a losing game because racism will never be okay.


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bumnummies
post Apr 30th 2011, 9:15 PM
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QUOTE(ColonelKlink @ Apr 30th 2011, 5:25 PM) *

For those people who are just joining us they should know that you've outright claimed that you're a socialist, so when I declare that I'm offended by the things that you write based on your love of socialism should that give me the right to call the police and have you arrested? After all, I have a right to be offended, you said so yourself. My being offended by you gives me the right to have you arrested for offending me. See, even this post of yours and the logic you use offends me.


Free speech/free belief and racism are two completely different things. The fact you can't differentiate these is laughable. giggle.gif

This won't stand up in court, for the record.


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ColonelKlink
post Apr 30th 2011, 9:30 PM
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QUOTE(CarrieFan702 @ Apr 30th 2011, 4:42 PM) *

You're upset because liberals have made insulting a person because of their race or ethnicity a crime. This is not understandable, because racism regardless of the level should NOT be tolerated, especially if it is in a place of business!

Why not? We tolerate lots of unpleasant things. We tolerate socialism. We tolerate misogyny. We tolerate the burning of the flag. We tolerate anti-Americanism. We tolerate the debasement of our culture. We tolerate leftist political ideology replacing facts in our school curriculum. We tolerate abortion. There are lots of things that individuals don't like which are tolerated by society. We don't arrest socialists for giving speeches in public. We give socialists all the rope they need to hang themselves as they give full expression to their odious ideas and the public sees them for the vile people that they really are. Do the same for racists. Good ideas rise to the surface and bad ideas sink under their own weight.
QUOTE
I do not agree that the guy should be arrested, because the punishment does not fit the crime.

The only crime that was committed was by the police arresting a singer for singing an oldie song which was a top hit back in the disco era. The singer didn't commit any crime.
QUOTE
People have a freedom to be a racist, but it is NOT right.

Good, I got through to you. You have the right to be a racist but you probably shouldn't be one.
QUOTE
We now have laws that protect people from being a victim of racism, bigotry, discrimination, etc., and that's the problem that you're having.

That's right because those laws come at the expense of other people's human rights. It's wrong to suppress one person's human rights so that another person doesn't have their feelings hurt. The government now uses violence to prevent people from freely associating with the people they choose. The government now uses violence to prevent people from speaking freely. This is exactly what Niemöller was writing about:
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.

Pleasant speech which no one finds objectionable doesn't need protection, it's offensive speech which needs protection. As the area of non-objectionable speech diminishes there will be more and more leftist inspired violence to strip people of their human right to free expression.
QUOTE
The part that upsets you is that he was punished for ignorantly insulting someones race (which is also what would anger a racist).

Thanks for telling me what I find insulting. What would I do without you to help me in these matters. News flash - the singer wasn't "ignorantly insulting someone's race" he was singing this popular song:

QUOTE
Your argument has failed because racism, bigotry, and misogyny are NO longer tolerated, and if someone feels insulted because of their race, nationality, culture, sex, etc. it should be taken seriously.

Screw that, that's just giving power to the heckler's veto. If all it takes to arrest someone is to claim that you were insulted then get ready to live in a nightmare totalitarian state.
QUOTE
You know that this only proves to all of us, that you're a racist.

If this provides you with proof then you really are pretty dim.
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Let me just educate you for a second. It will NEVER be right to insult someone because of the color of their skin, ethnicity, nationality, gender, sex, etc.

Thanks for the moral education. Wow. You've set me on the straight and narrow. You're a godsend. Or maybe not. You see, I never argued that it was right to insult people, rather I argued that a.) singing the song isn't intended as an insult to Asian people and b.) even if it was intended to insult the singer has a fundamental human right to do so. There is a very elementary lesson that is taught regarding free speech and it is that you don't have to agree with objectionable speech in order to protect people's right to exercise their freedom of speech.
QUOTE
The Chinese people should not have to keep their feelings to them self because if they're insulted on the basis of their race it should NOT be tolerated.

Should I have the power to call the police and have you arrested because after reading this sorry-ass excuse for thinking that you posted I find myself deeply insulted that your guardians let you out into public unescorted and unsupervised?


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ColonelKlink
post May 1st 2011, 3:44 AM
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I see now why so many brainwashed Canadians feared the premiere of SUN TV. Look at the dangerous stuff that they're airing on TV. Why, you might be worried that impressionable Canadians might actually believe this stuff and find it reasonable and then turn away from Leftist dominated CTV and CBC and that would be awful for all of the Leftists up in Canada.





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JohnA
post May 1st 2011, 9:01 AM
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QUOTE(ColonelKlink @ Apr 30th 2011, 4:07 AM) *

Not obviously at all. The remedy to speech you disagree with is to offer better speech in return rather than jailing the person who says something that you find upsetting.

Darling, this is not a Disney movie. Discrimination and & hate speech may have serious consequences. People commit suicides for being discriminated, fall into depression. What the hell do you think is more important here to protect? A right to 'free speech' so dickheads can insult whoever they want, or people who are mobbed at job or bullied at school who's entire life gets affected by this 'right to free speech' and may led to serious damage? One's right to free speech and freedom should end when another human being's safeness and wellness starts. Based on your logic, we could say a remedy for stealing should be offering something better (for example charity donation) instead of jailing someone who's act we disagree with or find upsetting.

This post has been edited by JohnA: May 1st 2011, 9:05 AM


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bumnummies
post May 1st 2011, 9:22 AM
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CK, [you won't, but] you have to understand there is a huge difference between there being the popular opinion that yes, these two individuals took something way too seriously and reported it to the cops, and the fact the cops have to do their job under the law, although they probably could have just asked a few questions first to realize it wasn't legitimately racially motivated and that these individuals weren't being specifically targeted.

The fact this person on Sun TV is reporting on the stupidity that he was arrested doesn't undermine a legitimate complaint if these individuals somehow felt that his choice of song was directly targeted towards them in a racist manner. A quick, simple investigation can determine that it was not done in an ill meaning manner, and I'm sure the guy was not actually charged - just because he was arrested doesn't mean charges were filed, after all, because in reality it would never hold up in court.

Plus, who knows if words were exchanged between the parties, all we have is a one-sided report and apparently a TV reporter making fun of it (and by the way, that's not "news", that's just a random commentator that thinks he's funny).

We have these laws in place to protect people and YES, occasionally it leads to some stupid circumstances but in the end, it's for the greater good. Clearly you are "White Male" and would never understand what it's like to be anything but that, because you would never need protection under these laws. But as a woman, as a religious minority, as an ethnic minority... heck, even as an overweight person, a disabled person, mentally challenged, or a ginger, that's when people are often crude and where protection is needed.

Clearly you need to walk a day in someone else's shoes to understand. wink.gif


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